On the mic
Summary
Hosts Dave and Kool brought on guest ALEX DAMSKER, who said on the show that she was formerly a lawyer for the SEC. The first story was the allegation that Certik tried to extort Kraken for $3,000,000 after an exploit. Alex used it to argue for independent, on-chain security code audits where the auditors carry liability. Next came the Winklevoss twins' reported $1,000,000 each donation to the Trump campaign, which Alex questioned because declaring a side could isolate a company. She then explained why she sees tokens as "shifting assets" that current regulation and pending bills can't handle. Later the panel covered the Howey test, FIT 21, a proposed crypto lobbying fund and onboarding coin, accredited investor rules, and banking law history, and closed with a giveaway announcement and warnings about unknown tokens showing up in wallets. All of this is discussion, not financial advice.
Chapters
Opening monologue previews the guest, Michael Saylor buying Bitcoin, and the Certik and Kraken storyMomentAt 0:05:54 on X
Alex on decentralized dev teams, hidden backdoors, and the need for liable independent security auditsMomentAt 0:15:59 on X
Pre-audit QA approaches and holding developer pay until the first independent auditMomentAt 0:21:34 on X
Winklevoss twins' reported donation to the Trump campaign and the risk of picking a political sideMomentAt 0:28:32 on X
SEC lawsuits, the Ethereum decision, and tokens as shifting assets that don't fit existing regulationMomentAt 0:35:03 on X
Possible changes to the Howey test, FIT 21, and a window for the industry to write its own billMomentAt 0:45:34 on X
Whether Washington's stance on crypto has turned, plus distrust of politicians and inflation dataMomentAt 0:51:44 on X
Voice D's story about custody, oversight, and early Bitcoin as a non-accredited investmentMomentAt 1:25:03 on X
Giveaway announcements and a warning about the flood of new meme tokens on StacksMomentAt 1:37:05 on X
Key quotes
“without oversight and liability, it doesn't really mean anything.”
AALEX DAMSKER0:22:37Share on X
“We don't have extra people to, like, hate.”
AALEX DAMSKER0:30:04Share on X
“Because none of them understand this core truth, which is that this is a shifting asset.”
AALEX DAMSKER0:39:40Share on X
“Now here, look. We have a window. Right? While they're fighting over bills, this is where we all need to be uniting and writing our own bill and getting it passed through both houses.”
AALEX DAMSKER0:46:28Share on X
“this industry, it's fascinating. It might be small, but it's very, very loud.”
Kool0:57:59Share on X
Excerpts
Welcomes and housekeeping as hosts and regulars join the stage
- 0:03:54 Dave I love you too, Stuart. I love you too, man. I I love you, man. I love you, man. What's up, everybody? Icy's in the building. Benny's in the building. Now Lake, Whiskey, I saw you already. Kev's in the building. You…
- 0:04:59 NatNat Thank you. Thank you. Sorry about that, guys. You know, IRL stuff takes over sometimes.
Opening monologue previews the guest, Michael Saylor buying Bitcoin, and the Certik and Kraken story
Certik allegedly tried to extort Kraken over a $3,000,000 exploit
- 0:11:10 Dave Ethos guy's number one, Alex, because I'll tell you this much. Well, you know you're safe here. Like, we have a... I don't even wanna say a great female presence. Like, we have a decent one in terms of, quantity…
- 0:14:00 Kool Yeah. It's it's it's it's... This is the state of the market right now. Like, I I guess, I think, you know, we we have been in such a high interest rate environment for a long time. The the the liquidity is drying up…
Alex on decentralized dev teams, hidden backdoors, and the need for liable independent security audits
- 0:15:59 ALEX DAMSKER Yeah. Yeah. I pinned it to the top so... Just so you can see the story for anybody who doesn't know this story. It's an interesting story. So something aside from this is that... So Certik or Certik, I don't know…
Pre-audit QA approaches and holding developer pay until the first independent audit
- 0:21:34 Dave So this... I was act... This is what I was gonna bring up because I was actually recently talking to, I think it was a few weeks, maybe a month ago. I was talking to the CoinFabric team. And the CoinFabric team is a…
- 0:25:43 ALEX DAMSKER That's terrible. But but I think that's... Actually, liquidity provider is definitely getting you a new phrase of choice.
Winklevoss twins' reported donation to the Trump campaign and the risk of picking a political side
- 0:28:32 Kool Yeah. I do have one. I do have one. I have a question for for Alex, but let me just... Let me go with the the comments. So on my drive home... I'm I'm driving home, but I was leaving leaving leaving the store, and I…
- 0:29:10 Dave The Winklevai. I love the Winklevai. Look. I mean, didn't they just get... Didn't Gemini just get fined, like, a bazillion dollars for, like, what they were... Right? Not not... Yeah. It was something... They were some…
SEC lawsuits, the Ethereum decision, and tokens as shifting assets that don't fit existing regulation
- 0:35:03 NatNat Yeah. This question is for Alex. Alex, what's your take on the SEC constant lawsuit towards crypto? I believe they just recently dropped their lawsuit towards, Ethereum, but I believe they're still suing Coinbase, and…
- 0:39:40 ALEX DAMSKER what the hell I did with it. I have no idea what regulatory system should have be applied. All of these don't work. Every one of the bills that are that are going, there's 50 pieces of legislation now that are out…
Staking, DeFi liquidity pools, and the securities questions around lending
- 0:43:00 ALEX DAMSKER So this is really interesting. When we talk about DeFi applications, we're now moving into a different kind of securities test and a different issue. So, so far as we know, if you are doing staking, but you're actively…
- 0:45:03 ALEX DAMSKER This is this is where it is, but that's, that's where it is. So... And then when you when you do loans, to other people, that's a different test, and, and there is a security interest in that.
Possible changes to the Howey test, FIT 21, and a window for the industry to write its own bill
- 0:45:34 NatNat So, Alex, based on everything that we're seeing in the cryptocurrency market and the mass adoption... Because I remember when a few years ago, everyone thought that crypto was a fad, that it was gonna go away. Don't…
- 0:50:42 ALEX DAMSKER We're that country that we we can't actually do that stuff in. So, so all I can say is we we have to take advantage of this opportunity as much as we can. And if anybody knows anybody that that works with congress or…
Whether Washington's stance on crypto has turned, plus distrust of politicians and inflation data
- 0:51:44 Dave But, yeah, I mean, it's it's a crazy landscape out here. As... I mean, crypt... I mean, I guess, where do we go from here at this point? You know what I mean? Like, are we on the right path? And and to what we said…
- 0:55:50 NatNat Yeah. And it's it's the same problem in the stock world too because if you guys pay attention to the economic data, like, at the height of the inflation, when inflation was, like, skyrocketing, it's, like, 9% or some…
Crypto PAC money, crypto Twitter's reach, and industry infighting
- 0:57:59 Kool Nice. We... It's always the money, man. You got all the money. That's the way it is. Why do you think... We know we've raised over a... I think a 150, $166,000,000. So for probably the first pack or super pack for…
- 0:59:12 Kool governors and and senators are are are seeing all the noise on Twitter. They see how how loud... Like, if a... Just for example, Cynthia Lumas, she's, I think, one of senators that's pro Bitcoin. When she makes a…
Ideas for a community-funded lobbying DAO and an onboarding coin
- 1:02:51 ALEX DAMSKER I was just gonna say that, actually, it's not a terrible idea. It would actually not be a bad idea if we could get some of the mean communities to put aside some of that wallet for lobbying efforts.
- 1:07:17 ALEX DAMSKER Alright. No. The... They wouldn't like the... The congresspeople wouldn't like it. But Yeah. You know, like
Accredited investor rules, the wealth gap, and access to private investments
- 1:09:39 Dave Oh, generational Welsh too. And check this out. I'll tell you this much, Alex. That point, I I I heard this one time, and I was like, that that makes the point so perfect where, like, if you're not an accredited…
- 1:11:02 Dave Well, hey, Hi. I was just kidding. It's like, don't leave the candy bars in the sun. I'll take them.
Banking law history, carve-outs, and the Silicon Valley Bank collapse
- 1:16:13 NatNat I agree. I agree. Now, Alex, with regards to what you mentioned with the banking laws, don't we think that at some point, some of these banking laws need to be updated? Because they were they were created many, many…
- 1:16:33 ALEX DAMSKER I mean... Okay. I'm gonna say I have a huge bias here. So do you have to take what I say, like, with a pound or two of salt? I came into the space because I hate banks. So I'm just gonna say that so that you don't…
Voice D's story about custody, oversight, and early Bitcoin as a non-accredited investment
- 1:31:29 Dave Let's go IP nerd. I love that story, dude. That is gonna be, like, one of the best audiogram clips ever. He said I bought my Chrome at eighteen, sold it at eleven. Like, what the... Well, I don't know what just…
- 1:33:45 Dave Let... Because she hosted a space What did I mention? Hosted a space earlier today, and people were in her DMs with the petty... You know these freaking... The... With the petty bullshit of you didn't let me talk…
Giveaway announcements and a warning about the flood of new meme tokens on Stacks
- 1:37:31 Dave Forget the price. Let me tell you something. I had Jack on the program on Monday, and I didn't really know too much about this, dude. But this... Like, how these things are built and structured on chain is something…
- 1:39:32 Dave Oh oh, yeah. Dave Dave, before you go, can you take... Let's let's talk about the the Wells
Unknown airdropped tokens in wallets and why not to interact with them
- 1:43:16 Kool Yes. So I do have a question, man. I know you guys are are the stats DJ. I have a token in my wallet called Roaring Kitties. What the hell, man? Like, it's the Roaring Kitties, DFB. Like, I have, like, a thousand eight…
- 1:44:22 Dave Who's sending me these tokens then? I was like, well, I have this one. Like, I'm like, who's sending me 4,000 tokens? And I'm like, I I I didn't I didn't work with this. Like, where where where did it come from?
Short excerpts from the auto-generated transcript. Listen on X for the full show.